The frantic cries that changes to the gun laws intended to take guns away is illogical. By what means can the government take our guns without saying they will take our guns? The government isn't going to sneak thru a law that makes gun ownership illegal! Hell, our do nothing Congress seldom passes ANY laws so why worry?
Gun ownership and gun owners 2nd Amendment right to own and use guns is ENHANCED by adding Red Flag and improved background checks, making DEFENSE less needed. We KEEP our GUNS, but fewer guns get into sick people's hands!
The notion that only bad guys can get guns if a law is passed is a gaslighting deception.
Good guys will still have their guns, and they can get more guns. Bad guys have ALWAYS been able to get guns no matter what so why not make it a little harder for bad guys?
I ask the President and Congress to please protect us from gun use OFFENSE. I ask the NRA, gun owners, conservative media writer and talkers, and wrong-minded gun lobbies to stop saying the mass murder problem can be solved by DEFENSE.
The problem in mass murders is the murderer, and this will NEVER be solved by gun owners.
Gun management is all reasonable people ask when we support improved background checks and Red Flag laws. It is understandable gun owners want well reasoned laws. I am certain intelligent, sane, mature, reasonable, NRA member gun owners can agree to these two essential elements of improved GUN MANAGEMENT.
IT IS EASY TO DEBUNK THE ABSOLUTE ABSURDITY OF ONLY BAD GUYS WILL HAVE GUNS. Criminals get guns now, so a new law won't change that, but we might reduce the number of sick people who get guns with a Red Flag law. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result. In this case Congress is doing NOTHING likely to help us to manage gun use, expecting a different result, i.e., fewer mass shootings. Thoughts and prayers change nothing.
Doing nothing in the face of 2019 counting the highest number of mass murders, sadly fluffed by the word "shootings," at 41 (forty-one), defines INSANITY.
Mass MURDERS is when four or more people ae murdered.
Rather than say "murdered" the statisticians and news idiots say people "died" These people were MURDERED AND KILLED, they didn't "die."
The 41 mass murders was "the most of any year since the 1970s," totaling 211 murders.
The worst mass "shooting" year was 2017 when 224 were MURDERED, a year which got a big bump of 58 murders in the Las Vegas mass murder spree.
"‘Battling a Demon’: Drifter Sought Help Before Texas Church Shooting"
The gunman who shot two parishioners at the West Freeway Church of Christ had come earlier looking for food and money, church leaders said.
By Dave Montgomery, Anemona Hartocollis and Rick Rojas, Dec. 31, 2019
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/31/us/texas-church-shooting-white-settlement.html
"“Mr. Kinnunen came back to the church on Sunday, but this time, he pulled out a shotgun during the communion service and fatally shot two parishioners — just before Mr. Wilson killed him with a single shot.
We formed the security team just in case something like this was to happen,” Mr. Wilson said on Tuesday, as he tried to explain the church’s attempts in recent years to be both welcoming and careful. “People have to realize there are no safe havens,” he said. “Even church.”
Mr. Kinnunen, who had a history of run-ins with the police and troubles with drug abuse and mental illness, was also a deeply religious man who often quoted from the Bible, his family and friends said — just the kind of person those at the church in the suburbs of Fort Worth have sought to aid."
Two points I highlight tell us,
1. the church had a trained security team, not a possibly untrained, unprepared, scared, nervous citizen, and
2. the murderer was a man known to have issues, a sick man the church security team was alerted to watch.
The next part of this story I offer is the fact the murderer was identified before he killed, and the security team was positioned to defend parishoners if anything happened to confirm their suspicions.
"Though he had been to the church before, Mr. Kinnunen aroused suspicion among members of the security team on Sunday when he walked in wearing a trench coat and what looked like a fake beard. He tailed a family as they entered the church, which immediately brought attention his way.
“He walked across the parking lot to get into the building, and normally we don’t have a lot of people walk from down the road,” Mr. Robertson, the church elder, said.
Mr. Kinnunen took a seat toward the back of the simple sanctuary, an auditorium with a carpeted stage, a wooden altar inscribed with “This Do in Remembrance of Me” and a pair of water jugs that had been stuffed with bills and coins collected from worshipers.
“He seemed to be relatively pleasant until he got up and wasn’t,” Mr. Robertson said.
Mr. Kinnunen asked where the restroom was and then returned a few minutes later, Mr. Wilson said. “We were concerned,” he said. One of the church’s security cameras was soon trained directly on him, and Mr. White, who was part of the security team, also stationed himself behind him. Mr. Wilson stood near a back wall several feet away.
“I could see his right hand at all times.” Mr. Wilson said. “I was concerned because I could not see his left hand.”
Mr. Kinnunen approached Mr. Wallace, who was administering communion, and the two men spoke briefly. “No one knows what that conversation was,” Mr. Wilson said. The gunman sat down and then went up to Mr. Wallace again, this time pulling out a shotgun he had hidden under his coat.
Mr. Wilson said that both he and Mr. White drew their guns from their holsters. Mr. Kinnunen fired at Mr. Wallace and Mr. White from close range. Mr. Wilson said he had a clear shot at the gunman’s head. “The thing I teach in our classes, in our training, is you don’t do head shots unless that’s all you have,” he said. “And that’s all I had at that point.”
He fired once. Mr. Kinnunen, bleeding heavily, appeared to be dead in less than two minutes, he said."
NOTHING IN THE NRA EXCUSE FOR MURDER BOOK SAYS WE DO NOT NEED TO FIX GUN MANAGEMENT WITH BETTER BACKGROUND CHECKS AND RED FLAG LAWS, NOTHING EXCEPT MONEY, OF COURSE. THE NRA DEFENDS THE 2ND AMENDMENT FOR MONEY FROM GUN MAKING COMPANIES.
Here is a typical, incredibly disingenuous, naïve, ignorant report of the church shooting that IGNORES THE ESSENTIAL FACTS. This is a really poorly reasoned article. BAD!
"Thank the Second Amendment: Texas church shooting stopped in its tracks by armed hero"
by Brad Polumbo December 29, 2019
Brad may be an NRA member, a good gun owner, and a smart guy, great writer, but he is absolutely off the rails crazy here ignoring the true details noted above!
"Many Democrats and liberal media figures sneer at the “good guy with a gun” narrative when it comes to the debate over gun control, dismissing it as a myth clung to by Bible-thumping rednecks. Yet, if there was ever a single incident to remind us just how wrong they are, it’s the tragic church shooting that was thankfully stopped in its tracks on Sunday."
Where does Brad report the security team had identified this shooter and had THIS SICK MAN in heir sights, standing directly behind him, watching him, ready to defend the church members instantly.
The sad AND EXTREMELY DAMNING FACT Brad skips for the sake of his idiotic defense of the 2nd Amendment, is this. When the sick man pulled out his shot gun, that TRAINED SECURITY GUARD STATIONED FEET AWAY AND READY TO DEFEND THE CHURCH STILL COULD NOT STOP TWO DEATHS!
BRAD'S DEFENSE OF THE 2ND AMENDMENT IS HEARTLESS AND UNCARING IN ITS CORE GIVEN PEOPLE DIE WHEN PEOPLE SAY A GOOD GUY WITH A GUN SAVES PEOPLE!
THE WORST PART OF THIS IS THAT THIS 2ND AMENDMENT ARGUEMENT COUNTS BODY BAGS, SAY ONLY 2 DIED IN CHURCH THAT DAY.
I SAY THAT IS NOT THE POINT. IT IS POSSIBLE NO ONE NEEDED TO DIE!
Brad and his fear mongering argument says many more could have died! WTF!
"But things could have been much, much worse. Two armed people attending the service intervened and shot the attacker in his tracks after just seconds, undoubtedly saving many lives. "
A Red Flag law might have prevented all three deaths in this church this day because the church knew he was sick!
Brad tries to enhance his defense of the 2nd Amendment with statistics. This is not about your statistics Brad. I use statistics above listing mass murder numbers, but none of thestatistics bring people back to life.
"There is ample research, not just inspiring anecdotes, to confirm how common defensive gun use is. One study examining the prevalence of self-defense concluded that “almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million, in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms.”
Defensive gun use is not a myth. After how this heroic act unfolded, we should all thank God that this is the case."
Defensive gone use is not under attack Brad. It is OFFENSIVE gun use that threatens and kills us.
Sadly, the same unreasonable thinking of Brad is furthered by more unreasonable writers.
"Journalist ‘Smears’ Six Texas Churchgoers Who Pulled Their Guns on White Settlement Shooter"
By Pluralist | Jan 1, 2020
Gun rights advocates accused an Arizona journalist of “smearing” armed parishioners who drew their firearms on the perpetrator of a shooting at a Texas church over the weekend.
https://pluralist.com/white-settlement-elvia-diaz-gun-owners/
Elvia Diaz merely explained that the security guard in the Church of Christ was not an "ordinary parishioner," and was ready to defend the church when the shooter stood up to kill two people. Explaining this FACT as a "smear" tells all we need to know about "By Pluralist." Read the stumbling logic of this article to see some of the most ridiculous commentary you will ever see.
Diaz wondered what might have happened if the shooter had not been quickly killed as at least six other people drew guns.
These six or more defenders might have started shooting without checking who was in the line of fire if the shooter was not killed after he killed tow parishioners. Bullets do not stop when we want them to. Bullets keep going until they hit something. Who is to say these other six gun "defenders" were close enough to kill the shooter? . ended up killing church parishioners themselves, which, according to statistics, is often what happens when the "defenders" are not police or trained security.
I'm not sure what Mike Brest wants us to take away from his article, so let me help him.
Gun management by strong background checks and Red Flag laws is a good thing. Having lots of guns in the hands of good "shooters," all trying to kill a "bad" shooter at the same time is problematic in the most favorable scenario anyone can divine.
"Liberal columnist says it’s ‘terrifying’ that six parishioners were armed in Texas church"
by Mike Brest
| January 02, 2020
This sick man could have been limited from getting a gun with a Red Flag law.
"The Texas church shooter should never have had access to a firearm"
By Editorial Board of Washington Post - January 1, 2020
"
Lives were saved when a member of the volunteer security team at a Texas church fatally shot a gunman who had opened fire on the congregation during a Sunday morning church service. Thanks and praise for his skilled actions are due Jack Wilson. But what must not be forgotten or forgiven is that two innocent people were shot to death in a house of prayer by a man who — despite a troubled and violent past — had access to a gun because of this country’s lax gun laws.
“Keith is a violent, paranoid person with a long line of assault and batteries with and without firearms. He is a religious fanatic, says he’s battling a demon . . . He is not nice to anyone.” That is how one of his ex-wives described the gunman in 2012 as she sought a protective order against him."
More.
"The hero in Sunday’s shooting was not, as gun advocates would want us to believe, an ordinary churchgoer — the proverbial “good guy with a gun” — but rather a firearms instructor and gun range owner who has been a reserve deputy with a local sheriff’s department. It’s not hard to imagine an even greater tragedy if there had been someone less skilled than Mr. Wilson or if the shooter had been armed with a weapon that didn’t require it to be reloaded. Indeed, the next madman intent on killing as many people as possible, rather than being deterred by Sunday’s events, might conclude that he needs a more lethal weapon. Those who see more armed guards as the only answer are driving down a road of ever-intensifying escalation."
I choose to ignore the use of the off-putting word "Liberal" which tends to be sued to say the opposing view is stupid, biased, not worth listening. Maybe Mike means well, I doubt him.
I do not consider myself "Liberal" as that token implies a lot of baggage, and I am not dumb.
The fact is, an intelligent non-labelled human being realistic SHOULD wonder how many people could have been wounded or killed as 6 more shooters started firing!
My bottom line is that gun management is about managing the OFFENSIVE USE OF GUNS, not the defensive use or hobby use or hunting use of guns. Better gun management laws can help us limit offensive use of guns in mass murders.
